Do any ale yeasts metabolize malic acid?

[akueck]

Not sure about ale yeasts, but 71B partially metabolizes malic acid:
http://www.lallemandwine.us/products/yeast_strains.php#71B

Edit: ah, you mention that. Good job reading, Aaron. So, why not use it? It's on the fruity side, but that's ok.

 

[capoeirista13]

OK so I am looking to make a low ABV orange vanilla cider, I'm looking for it to sort of simulate an orange creamsicle, or an orange cream soda. B/c of this I figured it would be best to use an ale yeast. As I understand it, when yeast metabolize malic acid it changes from a tart flavor to a buttery flavor, I thought this would be a nice touch to the drink. However, the only yeast I know of that does this is Lalvin 71B. So basically, I am looking for a neutral (that means not citrusy and not estery right?) ale yeast that would metabolize at least some of the malic acid in it. The proposed ingredients are...

Ingredients
5 gals apple juice
3 oranges peeled for zest and juice in primary
3 oranges peeled for zest and juice in secondary
2 vanilla beans split and scraped in primary
1 vanilla bean split and scraped in secondary
2tsp pectic enzyme 24 hours before yeast is added
xg bentonite added at yeast innoculation
xg of mystery yeast
x lbs OB honey, depending on yeast tolerance

I figured the people who look at this forum would probably know ale yeasts the best.

Well I was under the impression that wine yeasts weren't good for low alcohol drinks, although I suppose I could try it, no need not to experiment eh?

 

[capoeirista13]

OK so the malolactic process is the changing of malic acid into lactic acid right? But certain yeasts, like Lalvin 71B, can metabolize certain amounts of malic acid. Does this mean that the yeast is doing a malolactic fermentation, and changing tart to creamy? If not, what does it do with the malic acid, and what does the end result taste like, in comparison to something that did not have any malic acid metabolized?

Malolactic fermentations are carried out by bacteria. There are some yeast that will metabolyze a nominal amount of malic acid, but the effect is not analagous to a malolactic fermentation. Basically the yeast ferment sugars and the malolactic fermentation (bacterial) splits off one acid group from malic acid to bring a somewhat creamy and less harsh flavor to your wine.

I see, thank you for clearing that up for me. Now just to do some research on malolactic fermentation!

 

[wildaho]

The "butteriness" that some ale yeasts produce is more a factor of diacetyl production rather than malic acid metabolization.

Diacetyl is also the primary "buttery" flavor in microwave popcorn. There have been studies linking diacetyl to lung cancer in the workers at factories that produce microwave popcorn.

I think Medsen has posted on diacetyl before, you might try a forum search for it...

 

[capoeirista13]

I was actually quite uninformed when I posted this. I thought malolactic fermentation was the same thing as when yeast metabolized malic acid. I now realize that is not the case. I did happen to see that post about diacetyl, and do not plan on trying to encourage any diacetyl production. So now I just need to do some research on MLF

Edit: So apparently diacetyl is produced during MLF, who knew? So I suppose I won't be using any ML bqacteria cultures then.

 

[Medsen Fey]

Oh, I wouldn't altogether turn my back on malolactic fermentation. Most of the great red wines greatly benefit from it as do many Chardonnay wines, Alsatian Rieslings, and others. It smooths out the acidity and may give that buttery component that can be very pleasing. I'm not concerned about a bit of diacetyl - it is a normal fermentation product of yeast metabolism anyway, any is characteristic of some English ales. You'll get a little diacetyl from the yeast no matter what you do, but the quantities are small. Using an ale yeast noted for high diacetyl production could also add that buttery character.

Most yeast will metabolize some Malic acid - perhaps 20%. I'm not sure which strains other than 71B are noted for higher levels. There is another yeast alternative to MLF which is schizosaccharomyces pombe which can completely metabolize Malic acid without turning it into lactic acid. This is now available in a product produced by Lallemand called ProMalic which is an encapsulated version that can be removed before it causes off flavors.

ProMalic®
For naturally lowering juice acidity Schizosaccharomyces pombe is a yeast that metabolizes Malic acid into alcohol. In theory, this yeast would be a good alternative to malolactic fermentation or chemical deacidification, however, it is usually considered a spoilage organism due to its production of off-characters when left too long in the wine after fermentation. Proenol has successfully encapsulated Schizosaccharomyces pombe in double-layered alginate beads. The product, ProMalic®, is added to the juice at the beginning of the alcoholic fermentation and removed once the desired Malic level is achieved. The safe use of ProMalic® Schizosaccharomyces pombe opens the door for winemakers who want an alternative to acid reduction without the production of lactic acid or chemical deacidification. ProMalic® is offered through Vinquiry.

I haven't tried this yet, but it might be fun.

For an orange cyser, keep in mind that it isn't the oranges that will be putting in a lot of Malic acid - they will have much more citric acid. The apple juice will contain most of the Malic acid. If you are worried about too much acidity, you can leave out the orange juice and just add the zest and get plenty of orange character.

Medsen