Status update with time line - Moving slow

[ddavis1979]

OK here is the latest.

3 gallon Car boy, 9.5lbs raw unfiltered wildflower honey, raisins, all spice, cardamom, Wyeast 4184 Sweet Mead Yeast, 2 Gallons spring water

Dec 27 7pm - started yeast and pitched into must at about 80 Degrees then put an air lock on top and let sit at about 58-60 degrees F.

Dec 29 - After no action moved carboy to a warmer location 65 degrees and measured gravity (1.121)

Jan 1 - After no action, moved to a different location (68-70 degrees)

Jan 2 - aerated

Jan 4 - aerated

Jan 6 - Aerated and noticed white patches or surface and started to get a lot of action in the bubbler

Jan 7 - Aerated and added Wyeast Nutrient Blend

Jan 8 to Jan 21 - Lots of action in the bubbler

Jan 23 - Action in bubbler slows down significantly so I take a hydrometer reading and aerate again (SG = 1.090) also I removed all junk from the surface

Jan 25 - Bubbles again about about 12-15 seconds, but that SG reading means its only about 5% ABV. Yeast has 11% tolerance.

Do I feed again? Do I continue to aerate? Do I leave it alone and measure again in 10-14 days?

 

[Squatchy]

did you just pitch the single smack pack? I see you mention a starter. Did you put it on a starter for a while to let it grow? How long did it grow? What was the temp of the starter and the slurry when you pitched? Can you buy more yeast? That yeast is notorious for not working very well. There is a process you can do to pitch again and slowly move the must over to the new vessel over a few days time bit by bit.

 

[darigoni]

It's been a month and if you're hydrometer reading is correct, it might be time to pitch a more aggressive yeast (EC1118 or K1-V1116). Hydrate, temper and pitch. Need to get this over with.

 

[ddavis1979]

Yes I pitched a single smack pack, I followed the instructions on the case, which was to bring to room temp (70F) and smack the pack, and let sit for 3 hours and the bag got all puffed up. So the yeast pack was at 70F when I pitched and into the must, and the must was closer to 80F.

Does anyone ever mix the different yeasts? I was thinking if I did re-pitch I could use the Red Star Cote de Blanc?

 

[ddavis1979]

When you say "hydrate, temper, pitch" you mean get the dry yeast wet and at the same temp of the mead and then pitch? Any issues with mixing yeasts? I do still have the Red Star Premier Cuvee, but I was hoping for something with more sweetness and residual sugars like Red Star Cote De Blanc?

 

[darigoni]

Yes, hydrate the yeast, then add small amounts of the must, until the temperatures are within 10F of each other.

Not a problem mixing yeasts, you just want to make sure that the yeast you pitch is actually going to take off and take over. EC1118 and K1-V1116 are both called killer yeasts, in that they'll start in hostile environments and kill/eat the competition. It looks like Premier Cuvée is recommended for stuck fermentations, so may be also classified as such. Yes, all these yeasts will eat through your honey, leaving you with an ABV of about 15.77%. If you want some residual sweetness you'll either need to add more honey (step feeding) or wait until the fermentation is complete, stabilize and then backsweeten to taste (probably the recommended procedure).

Or, you could just sit tight and see what happens..........

 

[ddavis1979]

No one has said anything about adding more nutrient.....so I assume there is a resounding NO, don't do that? Whats the consequence of that after such a long fermentation?

 

[darigoni]

FYI. Wyeast 4184 has a reputation for being finicky. Some people use it with no problem, but others have stalling issues. It's rarely (if ever) recommend as a yeast to be using when making mead

 

[Squatchy]

No one has said anything about adding more nutrient.....so I assume there is a resounding NO, don't do that? Whats the consequence of that after such a long fermentation?

It's too late now. But you really need to learn to feed the yeast. Honey must is a desert for them. They have none of what they need to do a good job for you.

 

[ddavis1979]

Squatchy, I ordered 3lbs of Orange Blossom Honey, and I plan on doing a gallon of must and use the Red Star Cote Des Blanc Yeast. I have read CH. 10 of the guide, but wanted to know more specifics.

Given this brand of yeast, and the amount, and using WYeast Nutrient Blend. Would you add it to the original must before pitching the yeast.....would you let it sit for 24 hours before pitching yeast. Would you aerate and feed again after pitching yeast?

 

[Squatchy]

We never feed until you see proof of fermentation in the vessel. Otherwise, you start off feeding the bad guys why the good guys are still getting suited up for the big game.

 

[ddavis1979]

**UPDATE** and time for more advice!

small recap - OG 1.121, pitched yeast on 27 DEC, 10 days before noticeable fermentation after aerating and feeding. SG right now is 1.070 (approx. 6%-8% ABV depending on how you measure). 3 gallons must with a smack pack of Wyeast 4184 Sweet Mead Yeast.

I degassed again today but there is still a lot of CO2 in the must. And is still extremely cloudy. I can tell there are some lees at the bottom but tough to see much more than that.

I did a quick taste test and I was VERY happy with flavor. . . . to the point that I would like to find a way now to halt the process, clarify, and bottle.

IS this something where cold crash and racking into a mixture of both metabisulfate and sorbate is good idea, or do I play the waiting game for another 3-4 weeks and hope it clarifies? Do I rack cloudy mead into other cay boy with no additions or cold crash? Thoughts?

 

[Toxxyc]

EDIT: Wait I must read before I post.

Lots of CO2 with that high SG might indicate that the yeast is still active. I would recommend you stabilize and cold crash to get it to clear and to stop fermentation, otherwise the yeast might continue to eat the sugar and you'll end up with a dryer mead.

 

[Squatchy]

I can't ever imagine you liking it at that gravity once you settle down past the excitement stage. That high of a final gravity would need to be a mead that has 18-20 ABV to balance the cloying sweetness.

 

[Stasis]

I can't ever imagine you liking it at that gravity once you settle down past the excitement stage. That high of a final gravity would need to be a mead that has 18-20 ABV to balance the cloying sweetness.

at that sweetness and that abv you're still more similar to a sweet liqueur rather than mead. I.e in my opinion at that sweetness no abv can balance it out without you almost looking at it and even presenting it as something other than mead. I mean I wouldn't give it to someone and tell them this is what mead is

 

[ddavis1979]

So....what I am hearing is, "Dude, be patient, and let it do its thing, even though its taking forever, because you used lame yeast and inexperienced processes"

Although....a sweet liqueur doesn't sound bad. I do like Bunratty Meade, and Jack Daniels Tennessee Honey a lot, hah!

 

[Squatchy]

at that sweetness and that abv you're still more similar to a sweet liqueur rather than mead. I.e in my opinion at that sweetness no abv can balance it out without you almost looking at it and even presenting it as something other than mead. I mean I wouldn't give it to someone and tell them this is what mead is

Have you not had Polish meads Stasis? It's very common for that to be a final gravity

 

[Toxxyc]

Honestly I wouldn't mind producing super-sweet mead on a regular basis. Like, desert wine sweet. Like Muscadel or Hanepoot. I like it, wife likes it, most of my family likes it, so if that's what they'll drink, that's what I'll produce. Compare that to dry mead which (from what I've read) compares to the taste of a dry white wine - I know perhaps one person who'll drink it?

 

[Stasis]

Have you not had Polish meads Stasis? It's very common for that to be a final gravity

I've heard of polish meads since the first month I came to these forums.
This is very similar to the Maltese way of making wine. You add sugars until the yeast poop out, then you keep adding sugars until it tastes good. I highly suspect this is the way the pols came up with their recipes since it's a very simple and common way of thinking. It's the way my uncles and dad made their wine and they have absolutely no idea what is happening. For example one year they say it's good by adding a kg of sugar, the year after that they add a kg of sugar because clearly that's what made it good but it turns out bad. They say the grapes were bad but in reality maybe the yeast ate more sugars and they were actually making bad wine every year if only the sugars did not cover up defects. Same story with polish meads you have measurements of honey and that's about it
I am not a fan of this method or of excessive sugars. I wouldn't present something like that to anyone and tell them this is mead even if it technically is