First go at mead making... advice?

[Medsen Fey]

Is this 'normal' after adding nutrients and sitting for just over 24 hours? Batches #1 and #3 now fall in line with what the amount of honey in the batch should have given for readings. It also means, that if these are correct, that batches #1 and #3 should have the yeast dead before it consumes all the sugars in the honey... Batch #2 is indicating on the lower end of the yeast tolerance, so I might need to do more filtering on that batch...

If your gravity reading is going up it usually means one of 3 possibilities:
1. Your honey wasn't all dissolved in solution when you took the initial reading.
2. Your second hydrometer reading is high because the CO2 bubbles are buoying the hydrometer up. Taking a reading on a fully de-gassed sample will tell you if this is the case
3. Either your initial or current reading was in error.

I will see about renting/using the filtering setup from Strange Brew to see what that would run... Or find out what size filter would work for the size batches I have, and plan in the future...

Ask them if the filter is an ABSOLUTE filter (as opposed to a nominal filter). Unless it is an absolute filter at 0.65 microns or smaller, it will not be adequate for stabilizing a mead to prevent fermentation in the bottle, especially with EC-1118. With this yeast, if you want to sweeten, and are reluctant to use sorbate/sulfite, you may really want to consider pasteurizing it.

One other question I have, not sure if this should be in it's own thread, but when you guys use StarSan, do you just let it air dry, or do you rinse it with clean (filtered) water after several minutes?

StarSan is a no rinse sanitizer so I don't rinse. I let thing drain and will then use them while they are still wet. When I'm storing something that has been sanitized, I just let it drain and dry before putting it away.

 

[Golddiggie]

As usual you provide great information Medsen... I'll let the implements sit for the 1+ minutes noted on the bottle before using them, and make sure anything that can hold fluid is fully drained... Such as the siphon...

I'll check on what filters are available from SB... How long do you heat, and what temp, would you pick for pasteurizing the must when it reaches completion to make sure the yeasties are dead...

Now that I think about it, I do recall that the family member that has a reaction to sulfites doesn't have the reaction with all wines, with sulfites added... I wonder if they use different amounts, brands (if there is such a thing) or sometimes don't add something that is more commonly added/used... I'm thinking that I should have some on hand, in case I need to use them to properly stop the yeast if the need arises... Better to have an option and not need to use it, than need to use it and not have it...

I'm thinking that comment 1 for the readings being off is the reason for the change... As I mentioned, the melomel honey was the most fluid when I started, so it was most likely fully dissolved into solution, unlike the other two batches... Next time...

Well, about time to aerate the musts... Since the melomel is progressing faster, I'm planning on taking hydrometer readings before every aeration... I'll take them once per day on the other two batches...

 

[Medsen Fey]

How long do you heat, and what temp, would you pick for pasteurizing the must when it reaches completion to make sure the yeasties are dead...

If you do an advanced search for the term "pasteurize" with McFeeley as author, you should find what you need.

Now that I think about it, I do recall that the family member that has a reaction to sulfites doesn't have the reaction with all wines, with sulfites added...

Most of the time, unless the person is a severe asthmatic, they are not allergic to sulfites. Also, if a person can eat dried fruits with sulfites (which contain an order of magnitude more than wine), you can be sure it isn't a sulfite issue. A lot of people's wine reactions are due to biogenic amines and products related to malolactic fermentation by bacteria, or due to compounds related to oak barrels.

 

[Golddiggie]

If you do and advanced search the term "pasteurize" with McFeeley as author, you should find what you need.



Most of the time, unless the person is a severe asthmatic, they are not allergic to sulfites. Also, if a person can eat dried fruits with sulfites (which contain an order of magnitude more than wine), you can be sure it isn't a sulfite issue. A lot of people's wine reactions are due to biogenic amines and products related to malolactic fermentation by bacteria, or due to compounds related to oak barrels.

WOW... Definitely learned something new today... That actually does make sense... Although it's been a while since I've known my sister to eat dried fruits, I know she did growing up... Actually, I'm sure she eats raisins, so I think you're dead on about the sulfites issue... I'll plan on getting some in the next couple of days (post Black-Friday insanity/idiots on the road)... Going to get one more 3 gallon carboy anyway, so I'll get the sulfites at the same time... Will definitely be easier to stop fermentation that way then filtering, pasteurizing, or cold crashing it... Especially since there's not room in my fridge to hold any of the carboy's, nor do I have a freezer that can handle them... Renting the filter would probably cost more than I can justify... I don't have a reaction to sulfites, so I'll be able to drink the mead even if she can't... ;D

I am thinking about trying to make a hard lemonade (1 gallon batch)... Thinking that if I start it in December, it could be ready by the time summer comes along...

 

[Medsen Fey]

Will definitely be easier to stop fermentation that way then filtering, pasteurizing, or cold crashing it...

Sulfites will not reliably stop an active fermentation (wine yeast can be tolerant to several hundred ppm of SO2). Chemical agents just aren't very effective when the yeast counts are very high, so adding them to a cloudy mead full of active yeast isn't reliable for stopping a fermentation.

To reliably stop a fermentation, you can either let it go until the yeast stop, or you cold crash. Once the fermentation has stopped and the yeast have settled out and it has cleared, using a combination of potassium metabisulfite and potassium sorbate (neither one alone is reliable) can prevent the yeast from restarting (and even then you have to watch for a time to be certain).

If you search "how to stabilize" you'll get some good info.

 

[Golddiggie]

Sulfites will not reliably stop an active fermentation (wine yeast can be tolerant to several hundred ppm of SO2). Chemical agents just aren't very effective when the yeast counts are very high, so adding them to a cloudy mead full of active yeast isn't reliable for stopping a fermentation.

To reliably stop a fermentation, you can either let it go until the yeast stop, or you cold crash. Once the fermentation has stopped and the yeast have settled out and it has cleared, using a combination of potassium metabisulfite and potassium sorbate (neither one alone is reliable) can prevent the yeast from restarting (and even then you have to watch for a time to be certain).

If you search "how to stabilize" you'll get some good info.

So I was mixing up my terms... Not looking to stop the yeast, just get it to not start up again once it's 'finished'... I'll search up on how to stabilize and read up on that...

Ok, so thinking about this a little more (tried finding dosages for stabilizing mead, not finding the info though)... I think I'll let the must sit on the berries for 6 days total... I'll rack it off into the clean carboy and continue to ferment... When fermentation has completed, I'll review my options for clearing it... At that point, I'll think about aging either over berries, or adding juice (if I can find it where I shop)... Once it's aged a reasonable amount, at least a few months I'm thinking (basically when the temperatures begin to go above 80-85F in my apartment), I'll check to see if it needs any back-sweetening... I'm also planning on setting aside a couple of bottles for long term aging (multiple years if I can)...

 

[Golddiggie]

Ok, so I found the thread that goes into pretty good detail about stabilizing the mead, before you back sweeten (if you need to at all)... I've bookmarked it for future reference... I'll get the potassium metabisulfite and potassium sorbate from the LHBS next trip...

I do have a very accurate grain/gram scale (digital) that's proven to be highly accurate (usually using it to measure grains, but grams it goes to hundredth of a gram)... Once zeroed out for what I'm placing the powder to be measured on, it works out great...

How long have you kept the two powders on hand and still have them viable? Would vacuum sealing them (have one of the foodsaver devices to vacuum pack things) help, or be overkill? I have a feeling that I won't go through much of the powders, especially if they come in large volumes (as the only container)...

 

[Golddiggie]

I've read (again) the section in the guide (on the main site) concerning aeration... If I'm reading this correctly, you only aerate for the first three days the batch is fermenting... So, once you're done aerating, you can install the airlock, correct? If this is all correct, that means that I can install the airlocks in my two carboys tomorrow and remove the blow-off tubes from them (and get that cleaned up)... Will make for a smaller footprint for the mead making... Once I have the melomel racked, I'll install the airlock there too, provided this is all correct thinking on my side...

Please confirm or correct me if I'm mistaken...

 

[YogiBearMead726]

The first three days is just a general rule. It may be longer, it may be shorter. Essentially, you aerate up to the 1/3 sugar break about two times a day (ideally). It's the same for nutrients, for the same reasons. This is when the yeast need the most nutrients and O2 to build thick cell walls and replicate to a viable colony size.

So, this is why keeping an eye on where the 1/3 break is is important. You don't want to aerate too much after that point (mead tends to be tolerant of oxidation, but best not to test it...).

And yes, that's when you'll want to put the airlock on as well. You can have open fermentation with no ill effects up to the 1/3 break. As you point out, this is especially nice to have when making mels due to the potential for the cap to get pushed up and out the airlock. Not fun to clean...

 

[Golddiggie]

Thanks Yogi... Looks like I could have longer to wait on the two non-melomel batches then... Those suckers are farting out of their tubes nicely... Think I'm going to aerate them as I have been, but without so much mixing once the tubes are back in... At least not tonight. Planning on getting another 2 gallon bucket so that I can swap out the one that's being used now...

 

[AToE]

Yeah, I've had batches where the 1/3 mark to stop aeration comes at 5 days, and a few at even as short as 15 hours or so, totally have to go by hydrometer.

Most of mine though the 1/3 mark is at 1.5 or 2 days.

 

[Golddiggie]

Well, the melomel hit the 1/3 break tonight... I've already fed it and given it another aeration... I'll rack it into the 3 gallon glass carboy on Monday, as planned to get it off of the blackberries... I'm projecting that the other two batches will hit their 1/3 break in about 3 days... Of course, I'll continue to check all three batches. Once the other two batches start getting closer to the 1/3 break, I'll take readings more often...

 

[YogiBearMead726]

Have you been aerating and adding nutrients to all three batches? This could help get them going quicker, assuming you haven't been already.

 

[Golddiggie]

I added nutrients at the start, after the lag phase in all three batches. I've been aerating all three at the same time too (well, going from one to the next starting at the same time, hard to aerate three batches at the exact same moment, living alone and all)...

Should I feed the other two batches before the 1/3 break? If so, I'll need to get more nutrient to feed them again at the break...

I need to start the evening aeration a little sooner I think... This staying up to 3am is getting to me... Need to sleep enough to not be a zombie during the day... Need to check the progress on the melomel and aerate the other two batches... Plan to start the evening process closer to midnight, so that I can be done before it's too late...

 

[YogiBearMead726]

You don't have to, but it would help. Do a search for "staggered nutrient addition" or "SNA" and you should come across some good posts about the benefits of adding small amounts of nutrients whenever you aerate, before the 1/3 sugar break.

Granted, you don't want to add too much, but if you aren't feeding your yeasts aside from what you first put in, I would add more. Especially since the two other than the mel started at decently high SG's. It should help get those yeasts going into high gear.

 

[Golddiggie]

I'll pick up more nutrients for the meads today... Was on the fence about going to the LHBS, but that clinches it... Need more bottles for the ale, plus a bottle tree, to use in just under two weeks, so I might as well get that too...

I was thinking of getting one 'spare' 3 gallon glass carboy to use when racking the meads... Thoughts on that thinking? Otherwise I'd have to rack into a bucket with lots of head space to it... I will have a 5 gallon carboy (PET) free by December 10th, so I'll be able to use that to rack the 5 gallon mead batch... Once the porter/braggot (still trying to figure out if it's still a porter, or a braggot now) is bottled, I'll have an available 5 gallon carboy that I'll be able to use for more brewing... Hopefully, that will work out...

Oh, and I'm starting to get tired of the wine thief already... It's ok in the bucket, but trying to pull enough to get hydrometer readings out of the carboys is getting old... Going to get some small diameter tubing to use in conjunction with a flavor injector (minus the needle)... That would/should let me pull ~2oz at a time... I'll get ~12" of tubing, which should give me the reach I need to get a sample no matter what... Actually, I'll get enough tubing to rig up two injectors, so that I can do one batch, then the other and then clean/sanitize after...

 

[Chevette Girl]

I was thinking of getting one 'spare' 3 gallon glass carboy to use when racking the meads... Thoughts on that thinking? Otherwise I'd have to rack into a bucket with lots of head space to it...

It's a grand idea in theory, otherwise you will end up having to rack one batch into a bucket so you can clean its carboy and rack the next into that, clean ITS carboy and so on until the last carboy is cleaned and then you rack the stuff from the bucket back into that...

BUT... you will have one empty carboy sitting on the shelf, whispering, "Fill me! Fill me!!" every time you see it...

...and thus, it begins... this is how I ended up with about 7 of the 3-gals, always wanted to have an extra kicking around for racking and never had the self-control not to fill it!

And in counterpoint, an hour of exposure to some headspace while you're racking shouldn't damage your mead, especially if you're careful not to splash around too much and you make sure you don't always do it to the same batch.

 

[Golddiggie]

Well, I do have a couple of weeks to think about the spare carboy idea... I need to get bottles, and such, to contain the other brews I'm making today. That way I don't need to run out and get them when it's time... Also getting more nutrient for the mead batches so that I can feed them a little more...

I'll have at least the honey kissed red ale to have at xmas eve dinner (should be carbonated by then)... Not sure about the honey porter/braggot yet... It's still in primary, might have it in secondary at the end of the weekend (waiting for the airlock activity to get a bit slower before racking it)... That might be bottled and carbonated by xmas eve, but I kind of doubt it... Itching to get a hydrometer reading on that one, but the bucket is such a pain in the ass to open, that if I do, it's getting racked into a carboy... I'm hoping that the porter/braggot will still have at least a hint of sweetness to it... I used the Wyeast 1056 in that batch, and it could be hitting some high alc content numbers... Potential is above the listed tolerance of the yeast. ;D Which should leave at least some sweetness left... Although it could ferment to the point where there's no carbonation... ??? Will see what it's like in time...

 

[akueck]

A little late, but back up the thread somewhere there was mention of dried fruits, sulfites, and raisins. Raisins are actually very often not sulfited. Your typical pack of Sunmaid raisins will not have sulfites. Dried fruit that almost always has sulfites unless specifically called out to be sulfite-free include apples, cherries, pears, and anything with bright colors or that tends to brown easily. Golden raisins probably have sulfites, but I haven't checked.

 

[Golddiggie]

Wouldn't they be required, by law, to declare if the dried fruit does contain sulfites? Especially if they're added by the company packaging them?

I did just look over the entire package of dried cherries (Mariani brand) and don't see any mention of sulfites or sulfates... I don't have an issue with things that occur naturally...

Still haven't decided about using the dried cherries in any mead... I'm not looking to make cough syrup tasting mead...

I think I have enough mead batches going, now, to hold off on making any more right now...