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Licensing to Start a Meadery/Brewery?

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Pipe down, comrade.

It sounds like your are an advocate of free market economics and the free association and exchange of goods between individuals... shame on you.

Don't you know that the government is just here to protect us from ourselves because we are too stupid to know whats best for ourselves and our families?

Everyone knows that there are NEVER unintended consequences when laws are passed, so we MUST trust our "elected" officials to know and do what is best for all of us.

/end sarcasm, political rant for the day

Also, you better check with the proper authorities before planting those grape vines... the feds might come in and force you to destroy them. Might I remind you of the Supreme Court decision Wickard v. Filburn...
 
ZachR said:
Pipe down, comrade.

It sounds like your are an advocate of free market economics and the free association and exchange of goods between individuals... shame on you.

Don't you know that the government is just here to protect us from ourselves because we are too stupid to know whats best for ourselves and our families?

Everyone knows that there are NEVER unintended consequences when laws are passed, so we MUST trust our "elected" officials to know and do what is best for all of us.

/end sarcasm, political rant for the day

Also, you better check with the proper authorities before planting those grape vines... the feds might come in and force you to destroy them. Might I remind you of the Supreme Court decision Wickard v. Filburn...
Click to expand...

I wish you were joking!
 
ZachR said:
Pipe down, comrade.

It sounds like your are an advocate of free market economics and the free association and exchange of goods between individuals... shame on you.

Don't you know that the government is just here to protect us from ourselves because we are too stupid to know whats best for ourselves and our families?

Everyone knows that there are NEVER unintended consequences when laws are passed, so we MUST trust our "elected" officials to know and do what is best for all of us.

/end sarcasm, political rant for the day

Also, you better check with the proper authorities before planting those grape vines... the feds might come in and force you to destroy them. Might I remind you of the Supreme Court decision Wickard v. Filburn...
Click to expand...

yeah freedom who needs it ... funny thing is , is that wickard v. filburn was in 1942 during the time prgressives really started to change things... its ok im planting grapes no where near grain and not less than 1000m from maple syrup so i htink i am good. i wouldnt want them to mix by accident. well i live in michigan so htye might come get my grapes and distribute them to brad d
 
Wow, these restrictions are rather odd. Seems to me that this limits new styles or even tried and true styles. Stifles the creativity and keeps things in the alcohol market the same. With the restrictions I am seeing how does one comercially produce barleywine. You don't. It's a wine with grain in it, which a winery can't do and a brewery can't do it either and call it a wine.

This clasification stuff is just stifling.

Ah, well, I am not a greedy goverment official eagerly trying to figure out how to tax something or a winery looking to protect my business because I can't stand up to the creativity of something new, or even a microbrewer trying to compete with the big breweries that you have to be a part of a union in order to do meanial tasks for, let alone in charge of the actual brewing. So what do I know about these things. I just know common sense and restricting creativity in a "free" market and not giving the consumer a choice of what to buy before it is restricted or classified to death is just not right.

Ok, end of my ranting, back to the home brewage. Home brewing will never go away even if they make it completly illegal. Like they did in Prohabition times.
 
Matrix4b said:
Wow, these restrictions are rather odd. Seems to me that this limits new styles or even tried and true styles. Stifles the creativity and keeps things in the alcohol market the same. With the restrictions I am seeing how does one comercially produce barleywine. You don't. It's a wine with grain in it, which a winery can't do and a brewery can't do it either and call it a wine.
Click to expand...

I think barleywine is just strong beer is it not? It's not actually "wine" as far as I know, and is just made at a brewery.
 
Matrix4b said:
Wow, these restrictions are rather odd. Seems to me that this limits new styles or even tried and true styles. Stifles the creativity and keeps things in the alcohol market the same. With the restrictions I am seeing how does one comercially produce barleywine. You don't. It's a wine with grain in it, which a winery can't do and a brewery can't do it either and call it a wine.
Click to expand...

You can make and sell it. You just can't call it "Barleywine" in the US. The "work-around" for this is that breweries are allowed to call it "Barleywine style ale" which is actually on the labels of a number of beers if you check them out.
 
Don't go blaming the govenment workers here. If there is a law, it was in almost all cases written and paid for by a business protecting their interests. "Greedy government workers" aren't sitting around thinking, "hey, how can I screw with mead makers today?" You are looking at big breweries and big wineries protecting their market share. That's why distribution is so ^%$ed up, and you can bet it is at the core of this, too. Limiting new styles? Absolutely. Until that money gets taken out of the equation, look for big beer/wine to give you more of same (thanks, SCOTUS).
 
ken_schramm said:
Don't go blaming the govenment workers here. If there is a law, it was in almost all cases written and paid for by a business protecting their interests. "Greedy government workers" aren't sitting around thinking, "hey, how can I screw with mead makers today?" You are looking at big breweries and big wineries protecting their market share. That's why distribution is so ^%$ed up, and you can bet it is at the core of this, too. Limiting new styles? Absolutely. Until that money gets taken out of the equation, look for big beer/wine to give you more of same (thanks, SCOTUS).
Click to expand...

We have a tier system here in Texas that prevents alcohol manufacturers from vending their own products for consumption on site. They have to sell to a distributer who in turn has to sell to a retailer that can serve alcoholic beverages on premise. It makes life wonderful for the big dogs of beer while small brewers suffer as the result.

Well, when InBev built Sea World they got all in a tizzy because they couldn't vend their own products at their theme park. So, they paid off some government dude to sign the "Marine Mamal Exclusion Act" - this act allows manufacturers in Texas to serve their own booze at theme parks that (1) feature marine mamals and (2) are exactly the size of Sea World.

Yeah, yeah, I was about to buy a pet otter until I read clause 2. Doh!
 
I had a tangential question about this. I have read that you have to submit your recipe list when you are going through the initial process. How difficult is it to add to that list?
 
Sean said:
I had a tangential question about this. I have read that you have to submit your recipe list when you are going through the initial process. How difficult is it to add to that list?
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It's pretty easy, as long as you learn what the TTB is looking for. Essentially, each new recipe requires a new Formula to be submitted to the TTB for rejection or approval. In the approval, they'll also tell you what the label has to say to comply with Truth in Labeling laws. i.e. "Peach, honey and ginger wine" Don't even try calling it a mead if it's made with anything other than honey. They don't understand cysers, pyments, etc.
 
If I ever decide to get into it enough to sell, I'll investigate Canadian/Ontario laws and post something, the LCBO handles most sales but you can purchase wine directly from wineries I've toured... in the meantime, I'm really curious if anyone knows WHY you can't have malt on premises if you're a winery? I wonder if there's some legitimate reason at the base (like why I was told you can't legally keep a horse in a dairy barn - communicable diseases) or if it's some holdback from prohibition or something?
 
It's probably just something big-beer lobbied the government for against big-wine to keep them from infringing on the beer market or something like that. I doubt there's any "real" reason at all.
 
Beer brewing and wine making were legalized separately after Prohibition, so it might be a historical oddity. Not that that's a good reason to keep it....
 
Brad Dahlhofer said:
It's pretty easy, as long as you learn what the TTB is looking for. Essentially, each new recipe requires a new Formula to be submitted to the TTB for rejection or approval. In the approval, they'll also tell you what the label has to say to comply with Truth in Labeling laws. i.e. "Peach, honey and ginger wine" Don't even try calling it a mead if it's made with anything other than honey. They don't understand cysers, pyments, etc.
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That might be the stupidest thing I've heard, and makes me all the less likely to go into business on mead...(not because I haven't the capital for it(i don't), no, no, I just can't abide by stupid laws)(plus I'd be your competition, which I'm not at all interested in)
 
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